Episode 10 - Julie Inouye - On Balance and Compromises

Julie Inouye (00:00):
How can you actually be successful at being a parent? Is it the right thing to say, to like put that pressure on someone who's maybe only two years older? I don't know if you wanted it bad enough. You would sacrifice whatever it took to get that done. 

Young Han (00:07):
Hey guys, I'm young, a full-time dad and a full-time professional with the goal to become the best parent possible. The goal dad show is my journey interviewing fellow working parents, aspiring to be both good at work and parenting. I'm gonna do this by gathering and sharing unfiltered perspectives from my guest to join me. As I research parenthood one interview at a time.

My wait, I shouldn't call you Nuna. Ha. Oh, it's okay. I could call you Duna. Oh,

Julie Inouye (00:44):
You can. It's part of this. It's part of the story, I guess.

Young Han (00:46):
That's right. I'm so excited to have you on Julie, just for all the listeners out there. The reason why I called her Nuna is because that means sister and Korean. And this is my older sister, Julie. Welcome. And thank you so much for joining me on my show. I really, really appreciate you taking the time outta your day.

Julie Inouye (01:03):
I'm so glad to be here and it is really weird having you call me Julie.

Young Han (01:06):
It's really weird. It's very strange. I think I've called you Julie, maybe five times in my entire life.

Julie Inouye (01:13):
No, I mean, never only when you're introducing me to someone, I think that's right, but never. Would you say it to me? Yeah.

Young Han (01:19):
Yeah. How disrespectful? Oh my God. I know

Julie Inouye (01:23):
People call me older sister now.

Young Han (01:25):
That's right. I'm gonna refer to you as Nuna. Cause it does feel very unnatural to call you Julie. So I'll just call you Nuna moving forward. And now all the listeners know why I call you Nuna and not Julie. Okay. Very good. So thank you so much for taking the time. I do have to comment on your back backdrop. I love it. You like totally spruced up your, room. Yeah, it looks not it's so it's so nice and clean. Yeah, it looks great.

Julie Inouye (01:46):
Commenting on yours too. It's very fancy.

Young Han (01:48):
Thank you. Yeah. I kind of took it up a notch for this show and podcast. It's a little extra, but I thought it was pretty fun. Let's get into it. So I'd love for the rest of the listeners and guests to get to know you. So tell us who you are and what you do for,

Julie Inouye (02:04):
I am in the business of communications. I have been doing PR internal external communications for about 20 years. And I'm one of those rare birds. I studied communications in college. I interned in communications. My first job out in college was communications. So I've sort of picked lane early and I've stayed in it and I really love it. It's something that I think I'm naturally inclined towards. So it's been a good career fit.

Young Han (02:31):
I think you, you are a rare bird in the sense that you got to do what you did in college. I don't know that many people that have it's actually, now that you say it's very common. No, I think it's rare.

Julie Inouye (02:39):
Yeah. A lot of people like study something and then they go off and do so else or they do a tangent of something. But I think I got really lucky. I studied something that felt aligned and then I did a few internships to that check and it ended up falling into place. And I mean, now with the way technology is going, being in communications actually has allowed me to like jump different industries and different sectors as well because the constant across most companies is being able to tell your story as a business. And for me, that's exciting that I can kind of jump different sectors and not maybe have a background in that in industry, but able to bring in the communication skills and transfer it over.

Young Han (03:23):
Yeah, that is cool because of like just how the technology in the world is changing. You're able to like now dabble in, in hindsight, like you, that wasn't necessarily an intention, but you're able to do that. Did you always know? So like you knew like from the very beginning, cuz it, it is kind of interesting now that you say it. I never really thought about the fact that you kind of stayed the course, you never changed. And I did the exact opposite than you. I haven't done anything consisted my entire life.

Julie Inouye (03:50):
I don't know. I mean, I I'm trying to think back if I knew back then, I don't think I really knew for sure. I had an idea. I think when I started college, I thought I was gonna do some kind of international relations work actually and go into sort of more policy and politics, but I took a few classes and I did a few, like I said, internships and communications and I fell in love much more with that aspect. And you know, I, I still felt like at some point in my career, I go into that side. So I like moved to for a little bit and I tried it out more with the communications lens and it still wasn't the right fit. So I ended up coming back and I, you know, now I know technology and communications are the two, two sort of things that have crossed over that really, really work for me, and I think that'll be the continued sort of practice I'll be in moving forward thought. And part of what I mean by being able to dabble at different sectors, even in technology, there's so many different sectors and I love it because you never get bored. So, you know, you being able to sort of constantly work in emerging technology, things that are new, never, never uncharted territory and being able to tell again, those stories <affirmative> I think into new audiences in a new way, using a different channel, those are all really, really, I think interesting things to sort of uncover and I get to do that in the role that I'm in.

Young Han (05:12):
Yeah. Like the evolution of what communications is becoming, it's like it's having to adapt. Right. And, but it sounds like you've also found your niche. What's like communications and technology. And that's kind of like where you're starting to understand who you are and where you want to go. It's

Julie Inouye (05:24):
My sweet spot.

Young Han (05:26):
You gotta tell us what you gotta tell us what you do though, because what company do you work for and what do you do because you're, you're making this sound like not as cool. Yeah. Like you're super cool. You have, you've done so well for yourself. And the whole point of the show is to talk about people that are like navigating, you know, their work life and navigating parenthood. And I need to make sure everyone knows why I invited you. It's not some sort of like <laugh>, you know, some sort of like what's it called? Just cause I'm your older sister. That's right. That's right. Yeah. You actually fit the criteria.

Julie Inouye (05:56):
Oh, okay. Well thank you. I'm so glad I fit the criteria. So I worked, worked at a lot of different places, PR agencies to start. And then I moved in house to Yahoo PlayStation, LinkedIn. I joined LinkedIn actually, when it was still a startup, I took the company. It was part of the company when it went public and then, you know, built on its revenue streams, you know, $6 billion revenue by the end of the year, and then went from there to Visco, which is where I'm at now. So I've sort of done kind of a broad suite of things, internet, consumer tech, but each, each decision. And each company I joined was to explore something different about communications and, and technology. And I can obviously go through all those examples, but I mean, at the time the LinkedIn one is probably the most relevant at the time. No one knew the company. I remember telling mom and dad that I was going to LinkedIn and they thought I was joining the LinkedIn car company. They were like, what the heck is linked in?

Young Han (07:01):
No one knew. And I think, you know, it was like almost 10 plus years ago now. That's right, right. That's right. So no one really knew Facebook was around, but it definitely wasn't as big as it is today. And so this concept of social media, viral effect networks, that was exciting to me again, back to the point of like trying, being able to use different communications channels as a social network platform. How do you use communications as a tool for your company as well? And so, yeah, really, really just fun stuff. And then obviously now I'm working with a, a, a mobile app that helps you make, you know, beautiful photos and videos and, you know, their demographic is much more targeted to gen Z younger students. And so I have no business doing this job because I have no background in gen Z, but it's been so much fun and going from, you know, 16,000 employees to a 100 person, startup also has brought like really interesting, you know, executive leadership challenges that I've ever been able to kind of expose and do, and so that's been really fun. I love that you landed on Visco and it's really funny. Cause I remember that point when you were debating, whether you should work at LinkedIn or not. And it it's like kind of, it's kind of reminds me about like, just how you've always been so aspirational with your career. You've never wanted to stop. And I think you've always articulated that even after you became a parent, I, I actually recall you even saying that as a new mom, you were like, I don't wanna stop. I wanna keep going and I wanna keep growing and I want to keep finding the next thing that's gonna engage my mind or I can't remember exactly what you said, but there's something along the lines of like continuing to grow your, your professional career.

Julie Inouye (08:35):
Yeah. I love that. You remembered that. I, I have a, I have a funny story. I don't know if I've ever told to this, but I think up until Zoe, my second child, I always held out, maybe this thought that I might go freelance or I might do some kind of a part-time gig just so that I can, you know, pull back a little bit on the career ambition side and just be more available to my kids. And I just realized on the second mat leave when, after my second child, I had this like come to Jesus moment. And I was like, so nervous about like telling Ryan, my husband, this story. And, and you know, I basically, you know, sat him down. I was like, something really big. I need to discuss with you. I'm never gonna be that stay-at-home mom. I just, I think I know for sure, I will never be a freelancer. I'm not gonna be, part-time like, I am ambitious. I wanna see how far this is gonna go. And I, this is what makes me happy and he didn't even hesitate. He just looked at me like I've known, I started dating you. He's like you needed to come to that realization yourself.

Young Han (09:41):
Oh, that's so cute.

Julie Inouye (09:44):
A step. I know it's awesome. Like, it's the best, he's the best. But I took it a step further. Even after that, like that conversation. I said, well, here's what that means, Ryan, when I say, I wanna keep going you. And if I wanna just continue on this path, it means, you know, when the kids get sick and I'm out of town, like that could be a real situation. Like you're gonna need to step out of work. It's gonna mean I might get a call from my CEO because something's going on on the weekend and I'll need to do that. And ironically enough, like these situations that all come him to happen. Right. And he has been such a rock. And just, I think, like I said, it was, it was important for me to stay it out loud. I think he was already prepared and ready, but so that I didn't feel guilty in hindsight now. I think that's why I did that. So that I also was acknowledging that these were real situations as a mom and as a working professional, I would have to encounter and I would have to be okay with.

Young Han (10:42):
Yeah. And it's that level of self awareness that I think really is, you know, the reason why you're able to be successful at both. Right? Because you're, you're constantly trying to like one, obviously self realizing is important. But I think the thing that happens after you realize that for yourself is that you're starting, you're able to qualify what that means in the moment you could start qualifying what that means. I think that really like helps you like frame up what success looks like in my opinion anyways. And I, I think that's something that you do really well and it's like, Hey, I want to grow. I want to grow and I want to continue to do this. And you're also a good mom. Your kids are great. And so if we can segue a little bit into the kids, let's start by talking about your kids. Like, tell us, tell us about your kids. Who are your kids? What are their names? How old are they? And let's get that out of the way. So we can actually unpack some of this parenting stuff.

Julie Inouye (11:28):
It's weird telling you about my kids cuz you know them, but Ella who is nine years old and a little gem, she's just such a bright spirit. And I've got two girls, younger daughter's name is Zoe and she's seven years old and just, they're just, they could not be more different in their personalities. And I know you've got your daughters. So we have a lot in common in that regard. They're they're just the best I love. I love being a mom.

Young Han (12:02):
How do you qualify the success for being a parent and, and managing a successful career? Where do you draw that line and what does success look like for you?

Julie Inouye (12:11):
I try not to think about it as success. Like what does, I mean, how can you actually be successful at being a parent I'm doing air quotes. Like, and, and by the way, like when do you even know? I mean, right. Like, I don't know. I kind of question anyone who says they're successful. They're successful at being a parent because I don't know. I feel like every stage, the key kids are growing. And so my experience as a mom is also evolving, like the challenges I had with Ella and Zoe when they were like two and three is like widely different. Now that I've got them in school and their challenges are different and they have emotions and feelings and thoughts, like what, what is that? What's that gonna be like when they're in middle school and they start to have like <affirmative> into issues and problems and then they go to high school and they're like having existential, you know, crisis about like what their future's gonna be.

Julie Inouye (13:00):
Like, I just, for me, I don't think about it that way. Like I want to be a successful parent. I just think about like, what do I want them to feel from me as a mom? And I just hope that they always what they can come to us that they're gonna be heard and they're gonna be seen and they're gonna be celebrated for just uniquely what they're good at. I'm always gonna also be sort of like ambitious because that's just my background and I'm gonna try to support them. But even that I'm learning myself because I am finding that like they have to go at their own pace. And I'm just trying to think of a really good example. I mean, I don't wanna out my younger daughter, but the pandemic has been like really, really hard on, on little Zoe. And she was like doing really bad with her reading assignments.

Julie Inouye (13:49):
She's the first grade. It's like the first time she's actually been in like, you know, a full day of school. And I mean, they don't even know how to use a computer. I mean, goodness gracious. She's now a pro, but she was really struggling the first two months or three months. And she was coming in, I think like below two levels in her reading. And I, I took it as a personal sort of upfront that, you know, I'm a coms pro who entire living, it stayed up the reading, you know, communication. And I have a younger daughter who was like failing at reading and reading below her level. And I realized like I can't for, I can't, I can't have that kind of expectation. Right. Like, yes, there were also these challenges of the text stuff. So we helped, we helped her get there. But what's ironic to me is now, you know, fast forward, like the full school year, she's like at level she's she skipped all those, like she went above and beyond. She went above and beyond her other peers by catching up. And what I think really worked was not me forcing and telling her that she needed to close this gap, but more of a like, how can we help you? What can we do with you? Like again, that she felt supported and seen, but we know that this is hard, like reading with your friends on zoom calls is really, you know, nerve-wracking. Like I get it like, and those are like the little things day to day that I'm realize, like what, what works for me and how people communicate to me is going to be very different from how I communicate to my daughters. And, you know, because our, you know, we have the same parents and yeah, you know, our parents are very direct, you know, you didn't get asked about how you felt about something.

Young Han (15:31):
You just did it and you got told how you felt.

Julie Inouye (15:32):
I realized. So I just, I think that that's been my biggest learning in parenting is just trying to listen more.

Young Han (15:41):
No, no, that's a great answer. Yeah. I mean, it's like very, very like Sage, you know, in the sense that like you're saying, Hey, how could you ever be a successful parent? I mean, just even questioning the question, right? Like that's awesome. And, and then you answered it in, in the concept of like what you're trying to get the end result to look like. Right. Which is that you want your, your kids to feel supported. And so this is gonna be a really funny question because you're my sister and I've had the, you know, I grew up with you, but I've been asking everybody this. Cause I feel like there's so much parallel into how you become a parent. So I'm gonna ask it and can't wait to hear the answer, but what was your childhood like?

Julie Inouye (16:16):
I know, I just remember it being really loud, really fun. I mean, there were bits of it that I think we're hard, but I, but my love of, I, I wanted a big family and part of it was because I grew up with with three siblings, I'm the oldest of four. We just had, you know, a family nearby. Our cousins lived across the street. That's right. For me, my childhood is actually, I, I have a very fond feeling and memory of my childhood, you know? And I'm just trying to think like what other stories I can show that would like shed light on it. But like, you know, the other day I was just joking with my girls actually, because I'm like the crazy mom, you know, like dance with them. And Ella's now at the age, she's the older one is at the age where she sort of looks at me like, mom, you're embarrassing.

Julie Inouye (17:06):
Please stop, and I was telling her how, oh my gosh, you need to ask uncle young. And you know, and like about the time when, like we would drive, remember how we would drive to go pick up Nancy in middle school, you, I would be driving. You would be in the car. Our cousin and Ian would be in the back, we'd roll down the windows. We'd bless the music from our high go middle, bust the music, like crazy loud and just start dancing and singing at the top of our lungs and embarrassing, you know, the, but Jesus out of Nancy, all of, all of us doing this to embarrass her. And I just that's the stuff I remember about my childhood, that it was just, you know, love and family. And this is like very emotional again, this podcast

Young Han (17:56):
It's one of those hard hitting podcasts. That's what I'm going for. No, I don't, I don't mean it to be, it's just yeah, it's just like, no, no, no, no.

Julie Inouye (18:05):
I think it's also cuz you're asking it of me, which is why, cause there's a shared,

Young Han (18:10):
Totally shared memories, which is so happening. It really is like so interesting to hear your, your perception of our childhood. Right. And, and I, I actually relate to that a lot and I think you're absolutely correct. It was really fun. We were a really big family and I remember our get togethers and, and holidays were just massive, you know, and so many cousins our age and yeah. And it was so fun and there's just a lot of energy and a lot of loud noises and a lot of loud people, poor Nancy. Now that I think about it, cuz Nancy's the one quiet one and, and yeah, so she's probably always frustrated

Julie Inouye (18:39):
I do remember sort of like things, mom and dad would say to me that we're different than all of you, which was you're the oldest, you have to be better. You have to be you the one to do it. Right. Like I, I do feel there were things I was told and asked to be that felt a little different from the younger siblings. And I catch myself sometimes. Cause I'll say things like that to Ella, I'll say, well, you are the older, you're the older sister. You need to forgive your younger sister or it's okay. She does know better. You know? And I, and I, I kind of stopped myself cuz I wonder if that's like the right thing to say, right. Like, I don't know. Is it the right thing to say, to like put that pressure on someone who's maybe only two years older? I don't know. Is it, yeah.

Young Han (19:26):
I don't know. You don't ask me. I'm less of a, I'm less experienced than you are and I'm also yeah, like, but

Julie Inouye (19:32):
I was just gonna say, but it has made me realize like it, it has, whether I fulfilled something that was asked of me or I was innately that way. I don't know this will be the question of the lifetime, but I do think that I fulfill like the oldest child role and the responsible one to a T play that role. Even now I remember Sammy used to say that he was more scared. Sam, our youngest sibling would say that he was more scared of me than he, he was scared of mom and dad because of what I would say or how I would react and totally, you know, he, he recently, he recently like moved to San Diego when I was the last one to find out. Cause he was so scared that I'd be so sad, disappointed that he was leaving our little, you know, center of gravity in the east bay. And I was sad, but I wasn't upset with him. So it's bizarre. I think just those little things I think are all like years and years of, you know, the role I've played in the family dynamics.

Young Han (20:29):
Yeah. No, it's, it's really fascinating like talking to you about this cuz it's like we have, we have the same child <laugh> so we like, we were, we grew up together. So it's really funny talking to you about this, but yeah. Like there's totally nature and nurture and, and you gotta, like, you gotta like think through that as you're becoming, you know, you know, as a, you know, as a parent, you, you're getting older and you're grow and you're raising your kids. Like how much of that do you wanna like change from what you grew up with and how much of that do you want to emulate? And you know, how much of that are you gonna support? You know, them being like naturally like figuring out what they're interested in, how much are you gonna force? Because this is the big conundrum for me.

Young Han (21:04):
There's a lot of things that I feel like dad and mom taught me that have made me successful. Like they, whether I wanted it or not, you know, like this, push this drive, this kind of hunger. And mm-hmm <affirmative>, I don't necessarily know if you get that without someone making you uncomfortable or forcing you to do things beyond your, beyond your capacity. And so it's like this constant balance where like, and you know, my wife, you know, she's always like young, you gotta take it easy. Like you gotta like let them like figure it out on their own. And like, so it's this constant balance of like, I'm like, no, she has to keep trying. I don't care if she can't do it, it's okay if she fails, but she has to keep trying, you know, and even it's something as simple as like writing a scooter and using her break, she was struggling.

Young Han (21:46):
Lilly was struggling so hard three months ago using this break, cuz it's a weird balance move, right where you put your foot in the back and she kept falling and she was just crying and crying and I'm like, you can cry and I'll hold you and I'll hug you. And, and I'm trying to be more nurturing than our parents were but I'm like, after you're done crying, we have to try again. We have to try again and we have to keep trying, because you're never gonna learn until you, until you keep practicing and trying, I kind of forced her through it. And I told Amy like to back off and let me just do this. And I was as nurturing as I thought I should be or could be, but I forced her through it. But what ended up happening was that she ended up accomplishing it and she was so proud of herself and confident.

Young Han (22:22):
And now we were able to go scootering in our neighborhood because her neighborhood has a lot of Hills and she just stopped scootering completely. Cuz she got to scared of the Hills. And I know it's a really small thing and we're just talking about writing a scooter, but it made me like think at a macro level, like how much of who we are like you and I like the, the, the drive that we have comes from, maybe you even more because of that first child pressure. But like there's a lot of pressure that put on us.

Julie Inouye (22:50):
Well, but it's not any pressure that they don't put on themselves. I mean, that's the part that I think I've as a mom now that I have much more there's more texture and dimension around it. I it's not just what they said, but how they also behaved. So dad would never ask us to do something. He wouldn't do himself that's right, right. Mom would never ask us to do something. She didn't do herself.

Young Han (23:14):
That's right. So, well, yeah,

Julie Inouye (23:17):
That piece of it, that piece of it feels much more, you know, rich now that I'm a mom that I can, I can understand like what was going through their, my, as they were saying it or as they were pushing us to do it. I mean different obviously for mom to say like, you know, you have to do this, this and this. Like she wasn't a career woman, but she wanted to be, she didn't feel that she had that opportunity. And so for me, she would always encourage me, but you know, but there were so many layers to like, I'm just trying, I'm thinking like a good example. But to say with, with, with dad, I understood like he was the type of guy. Like I remember when he says work hard and don't be lazy and you know, do all that stuff. I, I, I, I know what I, I respect him so much now looking back because even now he's, he, he's still doing this, but you know, I remember don't you remember this trips he would take to Korea and we'd come back.

Julie Inouye (24:14):
Like after a 12 hour flight he'd land, we'd land, we'd get in the car, he'd drop us off at home and then he'd go straight and he'd take a shower and then he'd go straight to work. Yeah. I, we were, we would all be like exhausted yeah. On the trip and let alone just the, the time, the time difference. But he would still go into work that day. Yeah. And those are the little examples of just when he, when he demanded excellence and he demand us to work hard. It wasn't something that was like off of like, I, I'm not gonna do it, but you need to, he would always do it himself too. So for that, I'm like just super, super appreciative. Cause I know how exhausted I am now raising my kids after, you know, doing it and working. I understand that so much.

Young Han (24:59):
Yeah. And that's really funny because like, I mean the, the listeners will now know this, but I I'm doing that. You know, tribute video where we all like, you know, putting together a video for father's day. And it's like one of the lessons that I've learned from him, it's just like so funny, cuz I'm literally like sharing. The lesson that I learned from is like something that he said that has always stuck with me. And it's this concept of like, you know, like business and success has nothing to do with how smart you are, you know how good looking you are. Well, you talk or any of these attributes that people think that, that, success. It's literally all about how bad do you want it? So whenever you fail, it's telling me that you didn't want it bad enough. And I'm like, it, dad, what the hell?

Young Han (25:41):
What the hell could a statement? Is that right? Yeah. But like, I've never been able to forget that. So now whenever I fail at something, I'm like, I didn't want it bad enough. You know, because yeah. The reality is when you think about the concept of what he's saying, it's like, yeah. So what if you're not tall enough to do that, then you have to train five times harder than to someone that's tall. Or if you're not smart enough, then go study 10 times harder than that person that's smarter than you. But like if you wanted it bad enough, you would sacrifice whatever it took to get that done. It's this whole mindset of like, go get it, like, go get what you want. And if you don't want it, then don't complain about it because your success is predicated on how bad you wanted it. And it's like, for him, it was just a, it was just a minuscule statement. But for me, it's like never left my mind. And so now I'm always just thinking about it that way.

Julie Inouye (26:26):
Yeah. He's never said that to me, but I, that sounds so like something he would say,

Young Han (26:32):
Yeah. I felt like it was the worst thing ever when I was in, when I was a teenager. And like, and now I'm just like, it's still like, he

Julie Inouye (26:39):
Doesn't understand me.

Young Han (26:43):
That's right. But it goes back to parenting. Right. Because now I'm like, I want my kid to learn that. And how do I teach my kid that yeah. It's so important that they understand the value of hard work and like being resourceful and like understanding that you can, you can drive things to success. It's just, you just have to like want it and you have to think about it hard enough, figure out an angle, figure out it with grit, labor, or whatever that may be. But that concept is something that I really wanna impart upon them. But I also like am such a pushover with these kids. Like I am like the absolute they're gonna yeah, of course. Yeah. They're like, they're like, oh my gosh. They're like amazing. And I don't know if it would be easier if it was a boy or not. But man, these two girls, like having me wrapped around their fingers, like it's unbelievable, but I do find myself putting a lot more. We know we see, I do find myself expecting a lot more from Lily than grace.

Julie Inouye (27:35):
And why is that? I think that's fascinating actually. Yeah. I mean, she's only like what two years older? Three years older.

Young Han (27:43):
One year. No, two years. Two years. Yeah. Two years. What? And a half older. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. It's very similar to our age gap. Yeah. Our age gap.

Julie Inouye (27:51):
Yeah. Yeah. But like see how ridiculous that sounds so that you would expect a child that's one and a half years older. Just more.

Young Han (27:58):
Yeah. Well the funny thing is they still expect that from you now that we're in that way, now that we're in our forties, they still expect that from

Julie Inouye (28:06):
No, and this is my point. Like you're sort of like wired through life in these roles, but it's okay. I mean, I do it with love.

Young Han (28:17):
No, I think it's awesome. And so are you, are you then consciously trying to like combat then?

Julie Inouye (28:23):
No, sometimes I do. So with Ella I think, I mean, you were saying the story about Lily and the, and the scooter, scooter. I think the thing that I'm realizing also is that yes, you wanna teach them how to do hard work, but then you also have to pair it with like listening, cuz I wonder if grace would respond the same way if you did that, to me, Lily is wired that way. Like when I observe Lily she's wired that way, where she needs that and she does well under pressure and she probably receives your feedback. Well, whereas if you were to do that with little grace, I wonder if she would Excel in the same way. Oh my gosh. Because I'm finding, cause I'm, cause I'm finding that the, the mothering I do for Ella wildly different from how I need to be with Zoe, they do not respond the same way.

Young Han (29:25):
Oh, I love that. You're deaf your mother styles and skills to the kid because of the, the reception that you've been getting. And you're absolutely right. Like grace is completely, she's already becoming a very different girl than Lily is. They're like completely like separating. Right. You know, and their personality. Right. And, and the way that they think and their confidence levels and their interests are already starting to separate. And it's only, they're only two and four. So I can't even imagine what that divergence is gonna look like as they get older and really figure out what what's out in the world, you know, what's your parallel to leading teams. Do you feel you apply the same methodologies <laugh> to being a mother, to leading teams?

Julie Inouye (30:06):
I do actually. Well, not all of it. I mean this, the ironic thing is everyone at work is always shocked when I'm not like a tiger mom at home. You know? Like when, when I tell people that I'm like super relaxed and like the kids get away with like all this stuff, like yeah. They're like, I'm so surprised cuz you're not like that at work <laugh>

Young Han (30:25):
Oh, wow.

Julie Inouye (30:28):
But I'm really, I'm the weakest link at home. If the kids know Ryan's the one that's gonna say no, and I'm the one that's gonna say yes. They know that they know this already.

Young Han (30:35):
Everyone knows that everyone in the family knows that I'm the weakest link always. 

Julie Inouye (30:39):
But, but I think so like in that regard, I'm different at work and at home. But I think what has, what is the same that I'm learning is even at work, I do this with people that report into me, but I try to find what they're naturally really good at. Like I really try to pay attention. I get, I get people all the time who come to me and they're like, Julie, I wanna be in crisis coms. They wanna be in crisis coms. And you can tell that they're not wired for Christ. <Laugh>, you know? Yeah. You

Young Han (31:10):
Know, they get nervous high pressure job

Julie Inouye (31:12):
And it's more than just yeah. And it's more than just being nervous. It's like, do they have the skills? Do they know how to handle intense situations? Are they gonna be able to move, move something forward? So I, I always give everybody the benefit of it that, and I said, okay, well here here's a project. Let's do this. Like, let's see how you do and let's do this together and I'll coach you. Yeah. But at a certain point, I try to have like really honest conversations with my team. Here's where it's not, it's not necessarily working. Like have you thought about X, Y, and Z? Like, would you be open to it exploring a role that really taps into this part? Like, you know, there's a woman who, again, who said she wanted to be in crisis coms, but where I found her being naturally joyful and excited and she would herself, her plans were much more thorough was when she would be doing presentations and she would be teaching and she would be sharing learnings.

Julie Inouye (32:02):
And I was like, I paid attention signals and she's now in a career I think in learning and development. Hmm. Which wow. I think is amazing for her. Yeah. But she's not in this high, high stakes pressure job where she has to work with media and reporters in a high, you know, high pace sort of intense crisis situation. I think, you know, I think it's better suited for her in the same vein, like people in coms that are really good at the interpersonal stuff. Like is that like people who rally like cross-functional partners, for instance, like, yeah, that's a really good skill. So what do I, what do I do? I expose them to projects that do that. Like I just, I think there's, there's certain things that you have to learn. And then there's certain things where you just have to like situate people where their natural gifts are. And I think teen structure and org design, not always you have that benefit or luxury, especially at a small company like this go, but if you can align what they're naturally gifted and good at with what they do for a living, like you've hit the jackpot as a manager and the leader of a team.

Young Han (33:06):
That's the parallel that you think that carries over from parenting and, and leading teams.

Julie Inouye (33:11):
I do. I do. I think that's the thing that I'm trying to do with LLL. Zoe is really pay attention to what they're naturally gifted at and just expose them as much as possible to opportunities where they can flex

Young Han (33:22):
Those festivals. Yeah. That's really, that's really fascinating. And, and, and is that sound like, like is like a new, newer revelation for you and you've like started to employ this over the last few. Okay. Yeah. Cuz it's very antithesis to like what I had assumed you would do as a parent because you have very dominant personality, you know, and you have a very <laugh>, it's kind of like a conundrum with me and Amy, right. Or Amy and I, I should say to be speaking properly here, Amy is very nurturing and I'm not, you know, I'm very like, you know, dominant in the sense of like, I know what I want. I know how, how I want want it. And I like, you know, push for, I, I speak up and I say what I want and you know, Amy's much more like at their level, like, Hey, give them space to figure out what they're trying to do.

Young Han (34:09):
Like talk to them about it and kind of walk them through. I'm realizing very quickly that I need to be more like her, not her like me. And I think there are times and instances where it's good to push, you know, the kid to like, supersed it. But I think you just hit the head the nail on the head by saying if that's the way that they need to receive it. Because like, for example, like dad saying that to me, the, the comment about like you, you failed because you didn't want, it was probably the right thing to say to me.

Julie Inouye (34:37):
Yeah. He knew you

Young Han (34:38):
Needed to hear it. He knew that that was gonna bother me. That motivated you. That's right. That's right. That's right. And like, whereas if, I don't know if he would've said that to Sam or Nancy, right. Cause like that wouldn't have made sense. He never said it to me either. That's right. Like it didn't, he never said it to me. Yeah. And so like, I think that that's like probably the key that you have to like get down to the personal level and figure out where they're coming from both as a manage at work and also as a parent. And that is a good commonality. I love it. Have you tried to employ any other tactics? Like feedback loops and, and, oh, sorry, go ahead. What were you gonna say?

Julie Inouye (35:11):
No, I was gonna say, but it all starts with listening and I think that's something that I've learned later in my career, you know, as, as a younger person kind of going through your career, it's like, well, I think this, I think that, and like you said so much of your time proving that you're this strong, smart, thoughtful leader, right. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> and so you end up taking aerospace and what I've learned in the past, you know, four or five years of running teams and managing is you need to be spending way more time that you with, with someone listening and just asking questions. And it's actually a lot harder to do to just sit there and ask questions. And those questions are actually not just random questions. They're very intentional questions. You're, you're giving people space to answer or figure it out, come to their own conclusion. It's not you filling in the answer. And yeah, I think there's a lot of care and thoughtfulness that goes into those kinds of conversations. And I do use that tactic a lot with Ella and Zoe as well. I try to ask more questions. Not, not because, well, I should say sometimes I know what answer I would like to hear, but at the same time, like I'm, I'm giving room for them to come to that conclusion

Young Han (36:22):
On their own. That's really, really good. And it's really, really nice because it's something that I need to work a lot on professionally. And I definitely need to work on that as a dad. Like I'm terrible at asking questions, you know, it's like, it's either like very yin or yang for me. It's like, I, I want to do this. And then they, they don't want to do it and they have to speak up and you know, like strongly say they don't wanna do it for me to go, okay, then we'll do that. Right. But like, and then I completely acquiesced and we'll go get ice cream and donuts, you know, for breakfast. But like, but like there's no like conversing about it. I don't like have that conversation. It's like, I want this and what I want and it's not angry, but it's just like, this is what I want. And then they'll, they have to like push back equally and I'll give in, but it's never this like compromise or conversation and something that Amy's been talking to me a lot about is like, you know, what kind of parent do you want to be when you grow up? Cuz inevitably, if you always have these hard lines, you know, you're not gonna be the friend, you know, and you're not gonna be the, the, the person that they come to talk to.

Julie Inouye (37:21):
The, the question of like, should you be a friend to your kid or not? I don't know. I'm I struggle with that a lot actually. Cuz the meaning, I mean I've asked Ella this too. I'm like, aren't I, your aren't I your best friend Ella? She's like, no, you're my mom. And to her, there's like a very distinguished line in her mind, you know? And I, it didn't, it made me kind of think about it that night because she's, she's kind of right. Yeah. I should not be her friend. I am her mom. I am her safe. I, I am the person she goes to at all costs. I am her safe Haven. I am her biggest cheerleader. I am, I am this. I am the person in her life that she can always count on.

Young Han (38:03):
Yeah.

Julie Inouye (38:06):
But you know, can you be, can you be friendly and have a good relationship with your child as a mom? Yes. Yeah. But I do think this concept of being your child's friend is, I don't know, I'm not going to make a bold statement and I don't think, not gonna say that that's not possible. I just, I think it's, it creates a weird dynamic that I think is really

Young Han (38:25):
Hard. I love it. I love it. That's really great. I love these like little like nuggets that you're uncovering for yourself. This is fascinating. Hey no, no. I, I just realized that I, I have you only for like five or 10 more minutes here, so I just wanna make sure I get to my questions yeah. To all the questions, but I definitely wanna ask every guest for questions. So I'm gonna tighten this up just because I wanna make sure that I'm timely with your busy schedule and then have, have you as a second interview at a year from now because I, I definitely have a lot more things I wanna talk to you about <laugh>. This is really fun. <Laugh> talking to you about being a parent. I don't know if we've ever had conversations like this ever.

Julie Inouye (39:07):
We do. We do just not in this dedicated way.

Young Han (39:10):
No, it's great though. This is awesome, but it just for the time sake, cuz we are, we are successful professionals and we should monitor our time as well. And so I'm gonna fire off these four questions that I wanna ask every guest. Okay. So I can get you back to your day. Okay. What advice do you have for other parents? And soon to be parents,

Julie Inouye (39:26):
If you are in a relationship with someone and you're parenting with another person, I would say set up some ground rules for like where you're line are gonna be and like how you want a parent, you know, the things you're gonna outsource, the things you're gonna spend money on the things you're not gonna sweat, you know, sweat, the small stuff, like decide what the sweat, the small stuff is gonna be. And I think that's so important because you know, it sounds so silly that that's the stuff that people end up fighting over. Or, you know, as a parent, you stress over and as a working mom, it sounds so silly, but both Ryan and I were working. And so we made the decision really early on as, as parents and working parents that we would outsource things that just, we didn't wanna do. So, you know, cleaning your house, the, you know, getting it childcare, nanny, having someone at our house to take care of the child, someone we trusted, these were investments we were gonna make, not only for, you know, our child, but for the happiness and you know, just goodness good vibes of our family.

Julie Inouye (40:32):
And I think that's really important because otherwise again, going back to like the day to day, you don't want that stuff to just start piling up as like either neglect or feeling like guilty or baggage.

Young Han (40:47):
Yeah. Nice. I think you can write a blog about that. That's probably really good. What's the small stuff, not to sweat, you know, if you can go in the same thread, if you can go back and tell yourself one thing before having kid, what would it be?

Julie Inouye (40:58):
One thing before having kids, I mean, sleep, sleep

Young Han (41:03):
yeah. Yes. That's right. Just sleep for 20 hours a day.

Julie Inouye (41:11):
I mean like, you know, I just remember so many nights when I was like single and go out or you would like stay up all night, like watching, you know, shows or movies and like, dang it, just sleep, just sleep. I mean, I also would travel, sleep and travel, I would say invest in your own discovery and exploration. So I wish I had done a lot more travel on my own, not as a married person, not as a, you know whatever it was like, but I, I wish I had traveled more. Oh, that's great. So I think it's just the, the mechanics of traveling with little humans is just harder and I wish I had experienced that stuff for myself as well, which, and, and do it again with my kids too.

Young Han (41:51):
Yeah. That's awesome. Yeah. That's really good. What's the most surprising thing that you've learned about yourself becoming a parent?

Julie Inouye (41:58):
I mean, I think it goes back to the earlier point. Like people, you know, you go, you go into parenting thinking like I'm super organized to the point that like, you know, when we go on family trips, I've got like Excel docs and Google docs out, our family schedule, like I'm that girl. So I just assumed I would be much more rigid or disciplined about how I would be a mom and how I would raise kids. And I'm realizing that like I cut lots of corners and I, I, my color outside of the line as a mom and I'm okay with it. And that's been really, it's been really surprising actually.

Young Han (42:43):
Nona, thank you so much for taking the time to talk with me today. And I really enjoyed our conversation and I really, really appreciate you carving me out of your busy day.

Julie Inouye (42:51):
I love it. Thank you so much. I'm glad you're doing this it's so you,

Young Han (42:55):
Thanks, dude. I'll talk to you soon. Thanks for tuning in to another episode of the girl that show we hope you enjoyed that interview. If you wanna subscribe to our email list and learn more, you can head over to the girl, dad, show.com. Thank you and see you next time.